Topic: Obama to speak about guns Wed

[luvmy45]

Here it is, the king will speak tomorrow.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2013/01/15/white-house-to-announce-gun-plans-wednesday/?wpisrc=al_comboNP_p

[roop]

Joining Obama and Vice President Biden for the announcement will be children from across the country who wrote Obama letters after last month’s elementary school shooting in Newtown, Conn.

that's a cute little stunt. who can argue with a bunch of kids? reminds me of something a comedian once said...

politicians have traditionally hidden behind three things: the flag the bible and children. No child left behind. It wasn't long ago you were talking about giving kids a head start. Head start, left behind, someone's losing fucking ground here. But there's a reason, there's a reason that education sucks and there's a reason it will never, ever, ever be fixed. Never gonna get any better, don't look for it. Be happy with what you got. Because the owners of his country don't want that. I'm talkin about the real owners that control things and make all the important decisions. Forget the politicians, the politicians are put there to give you the idea that you have freedom of choice. You don't. You have no choice. You have owners, they own you. They own everything. . . . they own all the big media companies so they control just about all of the news and information you get to hear. . . .I'll tell you what they don't want, they don't want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking, they don't want well informed, well educated people capable of critical thinking. They're not interested in that, that doesn't help them. That's against their interests. . . . They don't want that. They want obedient workers. Obedient workers. People who are just smart enough to run the machines and do the paper work . . .It's a big club, and you ain't in it! You and I are not in the big club. By the way it's the same big club they use to beat you over the head with all day long when they tell you what to believe, all day long beating you over the head in their media telling what to believe, what to think and what to buy. The table is tilted folks, the game is rigged, and nobody seems to notice, nobody seems to care. -George Carlin

http://www.concentric.net/~marlowe/carlin.shtml

[SNAFU]

Here it is, the king will speak tomorrow.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2013/01/15/white-house-to-announce-gun-plans-wednesday/?wpisrc=al_comboNP_p

How much you want to bet that whatever he is going to say he will sign/etc has already been signed?

[charlz]

Signed 23 executive orders. Called on congress to re-instate a gun ban on assualt rifles and high capactiy magazines and universal background checks for firearms purchases. Nothing too shocking without having read the orders.

[Shade OGrey]

The list of this Kenyan usurpers "executive orders" may be found here : http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?2437011-The-List-Obama-s-23-Executive-Orders-on-Gun-Control

[No-One]

Cut and paste for those who care .

It doesn't even appear that the EO's close the so called "Gun Show Loophole" .

Looks like a lot of fluff that makes it easier to enforce gun laws already in effect . They know Gun Control is toxic for re-election campaigns and want to let congress take the heat is how I read it .

The following is a list, provided by the White House, of executive actions President Obama plans to take to address gun violence.
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.

[eddymunster]

obama care will make sure that we are all mentally unfit to own firearms at some point in the near future I am guessing.

[jasonrobinson]

obama care will make sure that we are all mentally unfit to own firearms at some point in the near future I am guessing.

Sadly, I can see that happening.  Or if nothign else, the national / state exchanges provide a perfect way for that information to filter up to various faceless red tape pushers and used to deny all sorts of rights (want to get your land re-zoned for commercial use to have a home business... sorry, looks like you visited an urgent care facility that asked you about gun ownership and since we think you own guns and that is dangerous, no change for you).

[Grumblecakes]

Preface: For the most part
It looks like these EOs are a copout. meaning it makes it look like hes doing something. There is some concern there but i think the EOs were crafted to avoid a show show down with the bill of rights at this time. But its still inevitable in the future i think.

His actions today are pretty consistent with his past ones. Make it look like your doing something and when you dont get what you want blame congress. And that's what hes going to do. He's now told congress to pass laws, which probably wont get passed by and large, and when they dont he can say its not his fault. Or if they do he can take credit and put a notch on his political belt.

That's the optimist in be speaking.

The pessimist keeps telling me in the long  run we are probably fucked.

[charlz]

The EO's are about the extent of his powers. I am sure they are also working carefully to not do something that may be deemed illegal on a technical basis.

[scoob]

OK, let's see if I can really stick my foot in my mouth...

1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.

Instead of the irrelevent data?  What the hell are they providing?

2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.

Meaning... remove the application of confidentiality to federal requests?

3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.

Just like any federal mandate... Your incentive to comply is that Uncle Sugar won't take away funding from unrelated appropriations that you have come to rely on.

4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.

Is this the one?  The 'build a "no-buy-gun" list' that has no provision for dispute, recourse, or removal of names that have been placed on it, like the 'no-fly' list?

5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.

Even if they are not suspected or convicted of a crime in relation to the seizure?

6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.

Let's make it look[i/] like it's voluntary at first...  right?

7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.

Like the one in Arizona that gets kicked in the nuts and censored at any opportunity?  Can you picture a sign put up by the federal gov't that says "Guns Save Lives"? 

8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).

Because we don't want any infants choking on locks, or toddlers bonking their heads on orlocking themselves in safes, and we want to allocate a rediculous amount of money for some bureaucrat to write another useless report that no-one nobody will read.

9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.

We need another law added to the existing 23,000+ already on the books, to do what's already being done.

10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.

Hmmmm... another report.

11. Nominate an ATF director.

Nah, not necessary.  Wait... how about Chuck Norris?

12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.

Hopefully that proper training isn't limited to "lock the door, huddle in a corner".

13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.

Someone else take this one...

14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.

"Guns are a disease!"  We're not accountable for our actions... it's gotta be a [________]-deficiency or a cookoo-bug.

15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.

"Manufacturers: Add more rediculous and useless safety features designed by lawyers and bureaucrats... or we'll pass more rediculous laws that cut into your profits."  [snicker-snicker - we're gonna do that anyway]

16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.

"does not prohibit" will eventually equal "requires"...doctors to ask questions that are none of their fu.....  well, you know.

17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.

No federal law... just their hypocratic oath.

18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.

"Guard" without the "armed"?  And they're really using the the term 'resource'?!  And again, does 'incentive' equal 'unfunded mandate'?

19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.

That's an odd combination.  Is that some code for getting the state into the church?

20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.

As soon as we can figure out what the hell it says, we think one letter will clear everything right up for you.

21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.

The pharmaceutical and insurance companies that wrote the healthcare abortion we passed said we forgot to cram a few more items into that monstrosity we didn't read.

22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.

There's that word again...  PARITY:  1: the quality or state of being equal or equivalent
2a : equivalence of a commodity price expressed in one currency to its price expressed in another b : equality of purchasing power established by law between different kinds of money at a given ratio

23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.

U.S. Department of Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius and U.S. Department of Education Secretary Arne Duncan...   I got nothing.


I'm not a cynic or anything like that... really!

[jasonrobinson]

I'm actually a bit surprised that Obama didn't go for some Executive orders that were outside the legal scope.  wow.  the first time I have been positively surprised by the president!

[Grumblecakes]

resource officer one is a joke.... the RO at my high school (centennial) was a uniformed, armed BPD officer. Hell he even helped teach a class (criminal justice) with the wrestling coach that showed students in the class how to defend themselves.  None of the hide in a corner bullshit either. he was mike lowe and was pretty well respected by the students and staff.


edit: i should clarify. its not a joke having them. But many high school and middle schools in Boise have them, why not apply this to elementary schools as well.
 
  Im sure the teachers union with their recent emphasis on student safety would appreciate seeing a uniformed officer of the law at the school. and would forgo a small portion of their annual wage increase to allow for a law enforcement agent to be present. 

Having just finished working at a school district. they waste WAAAAAY more money of frivolous shit like class parties every year than a uniformed officer would cost per year. (kinda funny one of the teachers whom was pretty well regarded for by the students was given alot of crap from the other teachers because his class wasnt 'fun' enough, ie was decorated with tons of crap and he didnt have parties at all.

[SNAFU]

Huh, and here I thought School was a place you got to to learn stuff, not have Party's...

[Shade OGrey]

   

16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.

And what law, federal or other, requires me to answer such a question, or to answer truthfully?

[fj40mojo]

   
And what law, federal or other, requires me to answer such a question, or to answer truthfully?

There is no such law, but it's a step towards breaching patient doctor confidentiality. Lest you forget that the majority of providers have spent a lot of time in the soup of acedemia persuing the degrees that allow them to practice medicine, a theatre predominately controlled by the left, and many I'm sure have drank the proverbial Kool aid. This is a green flag to them to start reporting anybody (gun owners) as "dangerous" individuals. If you think that the DOJ is above using a statement by a provider as a means to seize your property you are kidding yourself. Yes I agree that most of the 23 EOs were just fluff but there are a few that you don't have to dig into very deeply to find some sinister outcomes.